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Proxomitron Filters - Discussions welcome => Configuration Files => Topic started by: Jor on March 28, 2002, 02:52:22 PM

Title: Jor's config set
Post by: Jor on March 28, 2002, 02:52:22 PM
This set has been replaced with a newer version, see below (http://"topic.asp?whichpage=3&ARCHIVEVIEW=&TOPIC_ID=421#3447") in this thread. Last update 19-08-2002



The subforum still holds the old version described in this first post.


--------------------------------------------


Hey guys,

I've just uploaded a new version of my config set. Get it here:
http://members.outpost10f.com/~jor/files/Prox.zip (38kb)

My filterset includes filters from Paul's page (http://www.geocities.com/u82011729/prox/, some modified, some left unaltered, a few of the default filters, and some of my own devising.

This filterset replaces all earlier versions.

Some remarks about the filters themselves:

-I have placed them in "sections", this is mainly for my own use (I like to debug my filterset a lot), you may remove these if you want.

-The user agent filters I use are the five "User Agent:" Header filters, the five "Cloak UA in JS" filters, and the five ua-xx.js files in the HTML folder. The "default" filter sets your browser to identify itself as Opera, the other filters are for dumb sites (sites that use javascript to lock out certain browsers, listed in the "DumbSites" blocklist), and only select ONE of these. For example, iff you select IE in the header section, also select IE in the "Cloak UA in JS" filter section. If you choose Mozilla, select Mozilla in both sections.

-I use a pretty intensive Javascript blocking method -- nearly all functions are disabled, or altered. Refer to Paul's page for more info. My changes from his filters include a block for plugin snooping, and a change in the way pop-up filters are handled. (Thanks for the help Paul!)

-All the ad filters use Paul's blocklists. Some of my entries have been added.

-By default I disable Flash. All sites where I allow Flash are in the "AllowFlash" blocklist. If you don't like this, disable the "Convert Flash animations to links" filter.

-The "Image links to Inline (Not for normal use!)" filter will turn <b>all</b> image links to inline images -- I suggest you only activate it on image galleries (Which is what I wrote it for). Normal browsing with this filter will result in broken navigation on most sites.

Any further questions, feel free to ask.

Edited by - Jor on 19 Aug 2002  16:40:07
Title: Jor's config set
Post by: JakBeNymble on March 30, 2002, 07:51:25 AM
Hi "Jor",
        Good to hear from you! And thanks for sharing your Up-dated config.files. However, I can't get to them, because of my location. I keep getting:  
         "File Not Found  The requested URL was not found on this server".


Do you think that you might up-load them to the Sub-Forum? I would really like to try them out and see your improvements.

 Thanks to you, I now use Opera as my Default Browser, too.
I hope that you have a Great and Wonderful Day, My FRIEND!
"Jak"


 
Title: Jor's config set
Post by: altosax on March 30, 2002, 12:27:54 PM

to jak:
you got that message because the file is not there !!

to jor:
i'd like to take a look to your last release, please upload the latest one.

thank you,
and happy easter,
altosax.

 
Title: Jor's config set
Post by: Jor on March 30, 2002, 07:25:27 PM
jak & altosax: sorry, typed the URL wrong

Good to see you two are still around, I'm trying to get back on-line asap

Happy easter!


Oh, and I can't upload it to the subforum, as it is over 20kb

Edited by - Jor on 30 Mar 2002  19:30:09
Title: Jor's config set
Post by: Arne on March 30, 2002, 07:50:42 PM
Hi,
I changed it to 50kb. Is that enough?


Best wishes
Arne
Imici username: Arne
Title: Jor's config set
Post by: Jor on March 30, 2002, 08:54:15 PM
My config can now also be downloaded from the subforum (http://"http://arne.jaha.dk/read.php?f=1&i=34&t=34").

Cheers

Edited by - Jor on 30 Mar 2002  20:55:38
Edited by Arne  on 1. April 2002 since the zip file was corrupted. Now it is OK.
Title: Jor's config set
Post by: sidki3003 on March 31, 2002, 01:07:44 AM
Hi Jor,

The file in the subforum seems to be broken, at least it is during my download tries.

I also have a question concerning cloaking of javascript variables (navigator.userAgent, etc):
Do you see a way to make this work for IE as well?


 
Title: Jor's config set
Post by: Arne on April 01, 2002, 12:06:05 PM
I fixed the corrupted file.


Best wishes
Arne
Imici username: Arne
Title: Jor's config set
Post by: Jor on April 01, 2002, 04:43:51 PM
Thanks Arne

sidki3003: I'm not completely sure how MSIE identifies itself, if you block ActiveX and Java however, using my user agent filters should fool almost every website.

Since the ua-xx.js files are only using very simple ecmascript, I think MSIE should be able to deal with them. An easy way to check this is to load the filters in Prox, and then go to any UA report page with MSIE and Prox -- it should identify itself as Opera (if you leave my config intact)

 
Title: Jor's config set
Post by: sidki3003 on April 01, 2002, 04:59:25 PM
Unfortunately IE cannot be fooled that way.
Most probably below (IE-)Javascript variables are read-only:

navigator.appName: Microsoft Internet Explorer
navigator.appCodeName: Mozilla
navigator.browserLanguage: en-us
navigator.systemLanguage: en-us
navigator.platform: Win32
navigator.appVersion: 4.0 (compatible; MSIE 6.0; Windows NT 5.1)
navigator userAgent: Mozilla/4.0 (compatible; MSIE 6.0; Windows NT 5.1)  

edit: here is a JS test page
http://hotwired.lycos.com/webmonkey/geektalk/96/41/stuff/jstest.html


Edited by - sidki3003 on 01 Apr 2002  17:05:54
Title: Jor's config set
Post by: Jor on April 01, 2002, 10:22:17 PM
You're right, MSIE seems to ignore the js files

Afraid you'll have to edit the UA string in the registry to alter MSIE's UA.

 
Title: Jor's config set
Post by: Jor on April 12, 2002, 05:51:13 PM
New set uploaded:

Filesize is now 45'065b, and can be grabbed  here (http://"http://members.outpost10f.com/~jor/files/Prox.zip") (45kb, case-sensitive).

Changes:
-all redundant files stripped (I think)
-link styling filter and CSS included, and many filters changed to make use of this,
-hpguru's cool new killed.html included,
-tweaks to other filters
-comment included with zipfile

If you want to change the link colours, edit the top section of Prox.css -- before the commented line. See this topic (http://"http://asp.flaaten.dk/pforum/topic.asp?ARCHIVE=&TOPIC_ID=452") for more info on this trick.

Many thanks to Paul Grupe (http://"http://www.geocities.com/u82011729/prox/") for his excellent filters, and to the posters at this forum for their continued support

Edited by - Jor on 12 Apr 2002  21:49:42

Edited by - Jor on 12 Apr 2002  21:59:38
Title: Jor's config set
Post by: Jor on April 17, 2002, 02:16:36 PM
Yet another new set.

I've uploaded two different files now:

Prox.zip (http://"http://members.outpost10f.com/~jor/files/Prox.zip") (89'408b) contains all files needed, if you unzip this over a Proxomitron install you will have my complete config, with all textures, all javascript and other html folder files, my version of hpguru's new killed.html, and all needed blocklists (this really is the smallest version I could make it!

Prox-s.zip (http://"http://members.outpost10f.com/~jor/files/Prox-s.zip") (26'984b) is a smaller version, containing only default.cfg, Prox.css, and the javascript files needed -- all blocklists will have to be downloaded from Paul's page (http://"http://www.geocities.com/u82011729/prox/") or you'll have to make sure you use those from your own set.

If anyone would like another version, just ask.


Changes in this set:
-$STOP() added to a few filters,
-$NEST(<tag,</tag>) used instead of <tags*/tag> (much faster),
-other updated/altered filters,
-last not needed filters & files removed.

But see further below.

Edited by - Jor on 25 Apr 2002  00:03:54
Title: Jor's config set
Post by: Jor on April 24, 2002, 11:02:04 PM
Newer versions uploaded, see above post for the links.

Additional changes in this version:
-new filters added,
-removed not needed filters,
-allowed for multi-matching in a lot of filters,
-removed the link styling from prox.css and placed it in links.css

 
Title: Jor's config set
Post by: Jor on May 20, 2002, 02:34:46 AM
Just uploaded a newer version, it's a clean rip from my current config, and therefore the link styling is in prox.css, not in an external file.

I'll split it in prox.zip and prox-s.zip later, if I find the time -- for now these will remain on-line as well.

All needed files are included in this archive.

Download here (http://"http://members.outpost10f.com/~jor/files/ProxN4-J.zip"), 91 KB (92'501 bytes)

Edited by - Jor on 20 May 2002  04:24:18
Title: Jor's config set
Post by: JD5000 on May 20, 2002, 03:50:57 AM
Great, thx Jor.

--------

"Imagination is more important than knowledge" - Einstein
Title: Jor's config set
Post by: Jor on May 31, 2002, 05:51:08 PM
Updated my config set again, grab it here (http://"http://members.outpost10f.com/~jor/files/ProxN4-J.zip"). (This overwrites the version in last post). Filesize: 86'910b, that is 85kb.

Changes from former version:
-Changed the User Agent (default) entry to another Dumb Sites entry;
-Updated Opera version number to 6.03 in ua-op.js and the header filter;
-Changed killed.html to valid XHTML 1.1 ;
-Removed the Accept-Encoding filter, since returning * results in many blank pages on sites that use chunked encoding (for example http://www.computercops.biz/ BTW, I realize chunked is transfer-encoding, not accept-encoding, but it seems that unless a valid A-e method is given, chunked will not work -- at least not in Opera6/win.);
-went through all my blocklists and my config set, and stripped out last redundant files (I believe);
-Added a new blocklist, $LST(SkipJS), for use with the Tame Javascript filters. This fixes broken site navigation on sites like nvidia.com's driver download section.
-Updated start.js and end.js with Paul Rupe's newer versions. Changes from his set:
     in end.js: Renamed validateURLPROX() to validateURLPROXold(), and added two functions, validateURLPROXWDG() and validateURLPROXW3C().
     in start.js: added function NoError() to stop JS error reporting (handy for use with the Winamp browser window), disabled JS   navigator.mimeTypes checking (can be abused).

Tested with Opera 6.03 and Mozilla 1.0 RC3; not completely tested with MSIE (but first look seems to indicate it does work).

Edited by - Jor on 31 May 2002  20:15:34
Title: Jor's config set
Post by: Jor on June 01, 2002, 06:13:57 PM
Updated it again... use the link in the below post. Filesize is now 86'923 bytes.



Edited by - Jor on 01 Jun 2002  19:54:28
Title: Jor's config set
Post by: tomcat on June 01, 2002, 10:26:10 PM
Hello, first I have to say "Proxomitron" is great!!  I do have a problem, I have been trying to intergrate Jor's Config into mine.  I get an error loading page and was wonder if someone can give me some advice (jr novice here)...

When I start the program I get the following error loading page


http://-nohom%20e:/Internet/JAP/jap.cmd

Not a real big deal -- I just close it and continue but if it can be cured that would be even better!!

Thanks in advance

 
Title: Jor's config set
Post by: altosax on June 01, 2002, 10:35:55 PM
hi tomcat,
i guess your problem can be solved this way:

open proxomitron window, click on config then startup. here disable "run entry below when proxomitron starts".

hope this solves the problem, otherwise download and use jap ;)

regards,
altosax.

 
Title: Jor's config set
Post by: Jor on June 01, 2002, 11:48:16 PM
tomcat -- I am constantly optimizing my set, I suppose you downloaded one of the "lesser" sets

I found some corrupted filters in my default.cfg today, alas I have no idea when these slipped in, so if you are using my filters, I advise you to download the last version (http://"http://members.outpost10f.com/~jor/files/ProxN4-J.zip").

I do not have JAP on autorun anymore, so the newest config should not cause any problems like you describe

(I may follow JD's lead and alter the distribution so all files are placed in their own folders, but for the moment a "normal" filter redist is all I have time for).

[Edit: I may be "constrantly optimizing" my sets, but my spelling seems to suffer!

Edited by - Jor on 02 Jun 2002  20:57:41
Title: Jor's config set
Post by: tomcat on June 02, 2002, 06:10:44 PM
Hi, thanks so much for the fast reply...

I have downloaded your latest and it works great -- Thanks again

 
Title: Jor's config set
Post by: Jor on June 05, 2002, 01:33:01 AM
And again a new version...



Filesize is now 86’137 bytes, use link in the previous post ( http://asp.flaaten.dk/pforum/topic.asp?TOPIC_ID=421&whichpage=2#1824 ), or just get it here: http://members.outpost10f.com/~jor/files/

Edited by - Jor on 05 Jun 2002  02:41:24
Title: Jor's config set
Post by: Jor on June 10, 2002, 01:21:09 AM
Uploaded a new version just now, filesize is now 48'252 bytes.

Direct link: http://members.outpost10f.com/~jor/files/ProxN4-J.zip



 
Title: Jor's config set
Post by: sidki3003 on June 10, 2002, 01:58:57 AM
Hi Jor, could you explain what that does:

#Replace "Fix blink" filter
<blink*>2</blink>$SET(1=<span style="text-decoration: blink;">2</span>)

I don't get it.

 
Title: Jor's config set
Post by: sidki3003 on June 10, 2002, 02:07:44 AM
I mean, if i want to replace Scott's filter i would do:
<blink*>2</blink>$SET(1=<b>2</b>)
Right?

Anyway, moving this filter is a nice idea


 
Title: Jor's config set
Post by: Jor on June 10, 2002, 02:08:14 AM
<blink> is a Netscape HTML extension which was never copied by other browsers (much like MSIE's <marquee>.

There is a valid CSS style which behaves in much the same way, text-decoration: blink

I originally wrote a filter which replaced <blink> with the cross-browser <span style="text-decoration: blink;">, so Opera and other CSS-compliant browsers, will blink the text. But the Tag Manager filter is an excellent way to do this with, leaving me with one less filter in my config

If you don't like blinking text, use <blink*>2</blink>$SET(1=<span style="font-weight: bold;"> or something similar instead.

[Edit: you just added much the same method in a second post *LOL*)]

[Edit 2: just went to my testsuite with Mozilla 1.0... the final has native support for <blink>! Weird, because the earlier versions I tested didn't.)

Edited by - Jor on 10 Jun 2002  03:22:30
Title: Jor's config set
Post by: sidki3003 on June 10, 2002, 02:16:37 AM
Ah, Ok. Thanks

 
Title: Jor's config set
Post by: Jor on June 10, 2002, 02:17:11 AM
If you want a testcase for blinking text (even with MSIE!), go here: http://members.outpost10f.com/~jor/blink/

This is a site I setup as showcase for a still not fixed Opera bug btw.

 
Title: Jor's config set
Post by: sidki3003 on June 10, 2002, 02:33:54 AM
Well, it doesn't seem to be supported on my box (IE6),
but i'm not too much concerned about it

edit: the JavaScript trick does work.

Edited by - sidki3003 on 10 Jun 2002  03:38:52
Title: Jor's config set
Post by: Jor on June 11, 2002, 02:32:22 AM
quote:

the JavaScript trick does work.

Good, that's what I was aiming for *L*

Now to find a way to do Marquee in Mozilla and Opera...

 
Title: Jor's config set
Post by: pooms on June 11, 2002, 03:51:23 PM
Hi Jor, I decided to try out your filters to see what some of you
real expert filter writers were doing (rather than my hacked-up
version of the original Config file).

I ran into one problem that I'm curious whether you see as well.
If I go to yahoo groups and read messages, when I hit one of
the messages where yahoo does the "interrupt" thing to serve up
a page of ads, I end up with an infinite loop happening between
the browser and the server. It appears that it is caused by having
both the Yahoo relocator and the Never accept bugged cookies
Header filters enabled. Does this happen for you as well?

One other thing I noticed, the Kill Ad Tables filter removes
the main site navigation menu from http://www.space.com/
I haven't had time yet to investigate, but I thought I'd point out
that site to you as it is one that I've always had trouble trying
to remove ads from, but yet not remove important stuff!

 
Title: Jor's config set
Post by: Jor on June 11, 2002, 03:58:49 PM
Yes, I get the Yahoo problem as well, the solution is to add
URL = "(^$LST(AllowCookie))"
to the filter. An oversight of mine left that out.

As for the ad tables problem, I know this filter can be too aggressive. The solution is to add the site to the SkipTables blocklist

 
Title: Jor's config set
Post by: mycin on June 11, 2002, 04:17:32 PM
Hi. Your filter is great. Just one quip (a personal preference for me). How do I go about modifying the link settings. I don't want the strikethrough/purple on already visited links; I just want it purple (actually, how do i revert back to the original IE link settings? i'm so used to those). Can't seem to find where this setting is (yeah, i'm a newbie).

 
Title: Jor's config set
Post by: Jor on June 11, 2002, 04:36:22 PM
Hi, welcome to the forum

The link settings are in Prox.css (in the HTML folder)

If you know some CSS, you can alter the link colouring yourself, otherwise just download this file (http://"http://members.outpost10f.com/~jor/files/prox.css"), and overwrite your current prox.css. All link styling (except mark target=new) is commented out in there, so your normal settings will return.



Edited by - Jor on 11 Jun 2002  17:39:04
Title: Jor's config set
Post by: mycin on June 15, 2002, 05:29:04 AM
Is there a way to get just one specific URL to use a proxy and all others to just connect directly?

 
Title: Jor's config set
Post by: Jor on June 15, 2002, 04:22:39 PM
Sure, use a filter like
[Blocklists]
List.UseProxy = "..ListsUse Proxy.txt"

[HTTP headers]
In = FALSE
Out = TRUE
Key = "URL: Use proxy (Out)"
URL = "$LST(UseProxy)$USEPROXY(1)"

Place the URL to be filtered in a blocklist called UseProxy (if you save the example above as mergme.cfg, and merge config sets, just create a new textfile called 'Use Proxy.txt' inside the Lists folder, and put the URL in there.)

 
Title: Jor's config set
Post by: pooms on June 18, 2002, 07:03:49 PM
Jor: I've been noticing that occasionally on my.yahoo.com some partial
ads would sneak through and they always contained a form element. The
action attribute of the form didn't match anything in AdList, so the
Kill Ad Forms filter never applied. But inside the form were images
from sites that were on the AdList, so the Kill Ad Images filter would
remove them. I ended up defining a new filter to kill Forms containing
an image on the AdList, like this:

[Patterns]
Name = "Kill ad forms (2)"
Active = TRUE
URL = "$TYPE(htm)"
Bounds = "$NEST(<form,</form>)"
Limit = 4096
Match = "*<(i(mg|nput))*://($LST(AdList))2*"
Replace = "<span class="prox" kill="Form" detail="2" reason="9">"
          "</span>"

 
Title: Jor's config set
Post by: MaLuBoB on July 19, 2002, 12:43:22 AM
hey Jor,
I really like your config set so far.  I just had a few things I wish I could change because I don't prefer it exactly like that.  Could you tell me how I could go about changing it.  I like the way you have that box thing when you go over a link.  But I really don't like how it crosses the links that you have already went to out.  How can i disable this?  

Also I like it to block ads without showing me on the page that it it blocked them.  How do I go about removing the labels on the pages that show the ads were removed from there and which type of ad it was, etc.

Its really great so far, I just prefer mine not to show all that.  Thanks in advance.   Bobby

 
Title: Jor's config set
Post by: Jor on August 19, 2002, 03:35:24 PM
I've decided to do a complete update of my config set, this is the set as I am using it now. It is designed for browsers like Opera and Mozilla, that have a near-complete implementation of the W3C and ECMA standards. MSIE usage is limited.

Many filters are either by someone else on this forum (whenever I remembered, I mentioned it in the blockfiles used), modified versions of them, or filters inspired by them. Writing and maintaining good Proxomitron filters is a team effort as far as I am concerned

Thanks go out to (in no particular order) Arne, sidki3003, JakBeNymble, altosax, JD5000, hpguru, cj, Zhen-Xjell, Mona, and probably many others who have either given direct input for my filters, or who have designed filters I got many good ideas from. Also special thanks to Scott R. Lemmon, for designing Proxomitron, and for giving such good support whenever needed

The set itself:
Attachment: jor's-config.zip (http://"uploaded/Jor/200281916321_jor's-config.zip")   99,98?KB

Install by unzipping into your Prox folder. Make a backup of your /lists first!
Also note killed.html will be altered in the HTML folder, so make a backup.

By default all 'kills' are hidden, to enable display, edit prox.css: scroll all the way down, to the '/* Quick hack to toggle kill display  */'. Comment out 'display: none !important;', and comment 'display: block !important;' to toggle display of kills.


---
I've started to work on some documentation of all filters, but that is
extremely painstaking work, and therefore I've not yet gotten to a releasable version.

Some notes on the filters used:
[HTTP Headers]: Header filters
    Cache filters:
    • Cache-Control: Always cache (in)
    • ETag: Always cache (in)
    • Expires: Always cache (in)
    • If-Modified-Since: Always reload pages (Out)
    • If-None-Match: Always reload pages (Out)
    • Pragma: Always Cache/Don't Reload (Out + In)
    • Vary: Always Cache (in)


All these filters have the same purpose: they allow your browser to control caching again. All filters take the list AllowCacheControl into account, to allow for sites where cache control is enabled.

    • Connection: Close all connections (In + Out)

A filter disabled by default, it allows for closing all Prox connections quickly. In a way, this disables the most easily corrupted HTTP/1.1 function without needing to edit your browser settings.

    • Content-Type: Fix MIME types (In)

A highly modified version of Paul Rupe's original filter. Just about every content type I've encountered that is done wrong sometimes is in there.

    Cookie filters:
    • Cookie2: Kill unwanted cookies (out)
    • Cookie: Fool AdBuster sites (out)
    • Cookie: Kill unwanted cookies (out)
    • Set-Cookie: Never accept bugged cookies (In)
    • Set-Cookie: Never accept unwanted cookies (In)


All cookie filters use the AllowCookie list. They effecively block all not-needed cookies, and also strip bugged cookies, and help in fooling the ad busters.

    Privacy filters:
    • Forwarded: (out)
    • From: (Out)
    • P3P: Platform for Privacy Preferences (In)
    • Pragma: Block WiMP GUID Reporting (Out)
    • Referer: Fake referrer info (Out)
    • Referer: Randomize referrer info (Out)
    • Referer: Remove URL Commands and Prefix (out)
    • VIA: (out)
    • X-Forwarded-For: (out)
    • X-Kazaa-* [out]


This set of filters helps in protect your privacy online. Special note for the referer filters: 'Randomize referrer info' is ONLY called when opening a page in a new browser window, or when typing the URL manually -- not when following an in-site link. The 'Fake referrer info' filter is the one usually called, this helps view most if not all pages. The third one is privacy-related.

    URL Killers
    • URL-Killer: Kill script URL exploits
    • URL-Killer: kill-a-URL (out)


I believe these need no explanation.

    URL Filters
    • URL: Alias Redirector (Out)
    • URL: No proxy (Out)
    • URL: Un-Prefixer (Out)


Alias redirector is for the Jumplist. No Proxy allows for a list of sites that always bypass the Proxy: the NoProxy list is used. The un-prefixer helps stop some prefixing by sites (far from perfect).

    User Agents
    • User-Agent: Dumb Sites *


All these filters form one group, and should be used together with the Dumb Sites web filters. Their purpose is to fool certain malicious sites into letting you use your browser to access them, by altering the UA string. Note that only the headers will work in MSIE!

[Patterns]: Web Filters
(Documentation to be done. For now please ask if clarification is needed. Some are documented above in this thread).

Edited by - Jor on 19 Aug 2002  16:41:54
Title: Jor's config set
Post by: JD5000 on August 19, 2002, 06:49:21 PM
Cool! I'm gonna give it a try right now.

 
quote:
Writing and maintaining good Proxomitron filters is a team effort as far as I am concerned  


Agreed.

--------
Infopros Joint :: Computer Related Links And Discussion (http://"http://infoprosjoint.net/PN/html/index.php")
Title: Jor's config set
Post by: JD5000 on August 19, 2002, 07:10:36 PM
Hey now, I see some filters I already like.

BTW, you might want to re-eanble "Run Proxomitron as a systray icon", it took me a sec to figure out why it wasn't showing... LoL

--------
Infopros Joint :: Computer Related Links And Discussion (http://"http://infoprosjoint.net/PN/html/index.php")
Title: Jor's config set
Post by: Jor on August 21, 2002, 04:18:09 PM
Ah, that's what I forgot: stripping the entire 'general' section is the equivalet of setting most of it to false

I'll need to edit the user agent filters anyway...

Please use this file (http://"http://members.outpost10f.com/~jor/files/jor's-config.zip") (jor's-config.zip, 61'426 bytes) instead. (I'll try and edit the forum upload version later)

I just realized why my set is so huge -- it's the Proxominati2.gif file of course! I'll try and remember to keep it out of future distro's



Edited by - Jor on 21 Aug 2002  17:42:19