Author Topic: Forget security, privacy and Proxo  (Read 3090 times)

seeker1

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Forget security, privacy and Proxo
« on: July 03, 2002, 03:52:20 AM »
Has anyone here been reading about the new Palladium chip or the Windows Media Player EULA?  Uncle Bill and Uncle Sam are taking control of your computer.  If we permit this, Proxo will no longer have any validity and we would be better off without a computer at all.  Check out what is happening:


http://newsforge.com/article.pl?sid=02/06/27/1422247&mode=thread&tid=9

http://www.theregister.co.uk/content/4/25956.html

http://www.theregister.co.uk/content/4/25940.html

http://www.cl.cam.ac.uk/~rja14/tcpa-faq.html


"Let every man be swift to hear, slow to speak, slow to wrath"

James 1:19 <><
"Let every man be swift to hear, slow to speak, slow to wrath"

James 1:19 <><

JakBeNymble

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Forget security, privacy and Proxo
« Reply #1 on: July 03, 2002, 05:55:22 AM »
Hello Proxo-Users,

                 Yes I have been trying to stay up on what was going on for awhile "seeker1" and what was being talked about in the news about the new computers that would be coming out with a special new feature built into it. http://asp.flaaten.dk/pforum/topic.asp?ARCHIVE=&TOPIC_ID=641
Have a Great & Wonderful Day, My Friends,
"Jak"

 
 

hpguru

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Forget security, privacy and Proxo
« Reply #2 on: July 03, 2002, 09:12:52 AM »
If Palladium becomes a reality I may just go offline permanently and take up my old hobby of macrophotography. Without some measure of privacy the web just isn't worth the bother. I will choose when, where and what I share and when I lose that choice, my final choice will be to pull the plug and leave the net to all the ignorant somnambulatory masses.

Facing each other,
a thousand miles apart.
Facing each other,
a thousand miles apart.

seeker1

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Forget security, privacy and Proxo
« Reply #3 on: July 03, 2002, 10:09:55 AM »
hpguru,

I share your sentiment, but I guess that I'm just stubborn enough to continue to fight until the battle is lost.   Palladium is already a reality, but that is not as significant as having websites established which use it.   I can choose what components which are in my computer, but have much less to say about what happens to the internet.  If public reaction is strong enough, this will not happen.  All depends on public awareness and comprehension of the issue.

"Let every man be swift to hear, slow to speak, slow to wrath"

James 1:19 <><
"Let every man be swift to hear, slow to speak, slow to wrath"

James 1:19 <><

JakBeNymble

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Forget security, privacy and Proxo
« Reply #4 on: July 03, 2002, 05:54:40 PM »
Hi "Proxo-Friends",

                  I went back and read the articles just to see what was being said about Palladium. I guess I should have done that first. I have been aware of the "Palladium" project for quite some time now. But I have been more pre-occupied with certain other present aspects like profiling, indentity theft, Carnivore, magic lantern, "electronic stalking for money" that marketing companies and other such issues that come from some of the more sneakier areas of the Net.

I really have a hard time believing that this thing will go through, though I could be wrong. I think what will determine the out-come will be "money". If Micro-soft ever realizes that no one will buy anything from them that contains such devises , it would be very foolish of them to proceed with the project. I liked this quote from the articles.

[Its a little early in the game to worry about the apocolypse. Palladium isn't even sheduled to be scheduled until 2004]

And I always knew that Media Players were "spy-ware", and I don't even have any of them downloaded on my machine.

And I'll bet there are plenty of organizations that still believe in individual InterNet Privacy, and Freedom of Speech to let this thing get away from them without a fight. Remember, "You have no control over the serpent, after You let him Out of the box", so I don't think it will be a very Smooth trans-action even if it does go through.

Also I think there are to many other types of O/Ses out there for me to use instead of windows to "Go Quietly Into That Good-Night".
Here is another item I like when I read the articles. One guy said," May I suggest my (personally) favorite solution to that problem? ®" http://www.suse.com/index_us.html

And maybe Scott's next Proxo project might include a Proxo version for linux and other O/Ses if this thing does take off the ground.

As someone else on the FORUM said once, "Just my two cents"
Have a Great & Wonderful Day My Proxomitronic-Friends!
"Jak"




 
 

seeker1

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Forget security, privacy and Proxo
« Reply #5 on: July 03, 2002, 09:56:37 PM »
Jak,

Somehow, I don't think that you are seeing this quite in perspective.  Since Palladium is already shipping on certain mobos, I doubt that the implimentation of this is so distant as 2004 (that's less than 18 months away), but the date is much less important than the principles involved.  Programs such as Carnivore, Magic Lantern, etc. will become obsolete and irrelevant when this takes hold.  The fact that WMP has always been spyware is not the issue, but that Uncle Bill has used it's EULA to establish such a legal precidence, is more than sneaky, it's downright evil.  No one that I know of reads the fine print of every program's EULA before installing them, unless it is from a source they are suspicious of.  WMP is so ubiquitous and commonplace that I can't imagine that anyone would read it in detail each and everytime that they upgrade.  The everyday man has been so shocked by the events of the WTC disaster, and fearing more of the same, that it is not that difficult for MS, Washington and Hollywood to manipulate the general mindset.  We are all angry and upset about what has happened, but not nearly as much as the politicians and celebrities.   Why...because they feel like that they are the prime targets of the future.   True or not, I am not willing to give up my freedoms to protect either them or myself.  Without wanting to sound melodramatic, Patrick Henry's quote seems appropriate "Give me liberty or give me death".  Life is difficult enough with freedom, but would be intolerable under the tyranny that this will evolve to.  No number of organizations will be able to stop this, unless they are representing a vast majority  of the American population.   The vote that counts here, is not the one that is made in a polling booth,  but at the cash register . Despite all of the discussion of this problem on the internet, most people will not even know what Palladium is, until they have purchased a computer containing it and perhaps not even then.   The few people that may be aware may not comprehend the ramifications, or if they do, they may feel that this is justified.  The schedule that you speak of leaves very little time to take any effective countermeasures.  As a Christian, I know, by prophecy,  that all of this is inevitable, but that doesn't mean that I have to like it or submit to it.

"Let every man be swift to hear, slow to speak, slow to wrath"

James 1:19 <><

Edited by - seeker1 on 03 Jul 2002  23:03:38
"Let every man be swift to hear, slow to speak, slow to wrath"

James 1:19 <><

JakBeNymble

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Forget security, privacy and Proxo
« Reply #6 on: July 04, 2002, 09:15:41 PM »
Hi "Proxo-Friends",

                   Not at all melodramtic, I also share that senitment with You "Seeker1". And I like it when a person has a "passionately expresses" and asserts him-self.

Truely the idea of "absolute anonymity" on the net is a myth. All data passes through many, many servers before it gets to it's destination. Any just about everybody keeps a log. When T. Berners-Lee came up with the idea that documents on one machine could have links that could access documents on other machines, and the Net was born, he wasn't even thinking of security or privacy. So the InterNet wasn't even designed with these Issues in mind. The new Palladium chip doesn't introduce something new, it's just allowing an easier way to accomplish  what's be going on all along. Trust me on this one, I Know that it happens!

Up until a couple of years ago, I knew nothing about computers, internet, or anything like that. After that I had purchased the First computer, and hooked up on-line. I was so excited about it. I was like a kid at Christmas. And then I read a book Called "Hack-Attack", and I was devastated at what was going on! It revealled to me "Who" the real "CRACKERS" was. That set me on a path to find out what could be done about such things. I got "Cyber Street-Wise" real fast. And I tried to tell everybody that I could about what I had discovered. And Most people Laughed and said I was nuts. (Which I am, but that's beside the point.) I have had Free Work-shops at the Public Libraries trying to inform the public, and I wouldn't have to count very far to tell You the number of people that would attend.

It's just like the "Guy" that said to another, "You what's wrong with the the world, . . .Ignorance and apathy. What do You think?"
And the man replied, "I Don't KNOW, And I Don't CARE!"
Since the InterNet was not even in it's design, created without the Personal Privacy or Security in mind, so then it's every individual's responsibility to Secure his machine and take the proper steps to insure his and his Family's Privacy and Security. That is a choice that they must make and of course if they have the "I don't KNOW, and I don't Care" attitude there is nothing that anyone can do for them.

Also if the new computers are coming out with the Palladium technology, I will keep my old machine and do my own hard-ware up-dates. If You can't buy hard-ware that don't have it in it, . . .well, . . .Did You ever see anybody cut a catalytic-convertor out of an exhaust system? If sites won't work without have the "nasty" thing on Your machine, then I won't use those sites. As long as I can surf to ARNE'S FORUM, I really don't have many sites that I care surf to anyways. A few search engines and few software sites. Where there is a will, there is a way. There is always the option of Web-Tv. (No Hard-drive to access)And if the whole InterNet goes to *Hades* in a hand-basket, I've always got good old fashion Snail-mail and the telephone that I can keep up with my Buddies here on the FORUM. Though we all know that those resources is and has been tapped into before and exploited as well by certain organizations from time to time.

There is also the "phasing-in" effect. If sites won't work without having the Palladium chip on being on Your Machine, they can't just turn everything around over night or the "Masses will revolt". The idea for color-Tv was being worked on for many many years before that it was compatible the present TV signal system.  If they Changed the Whole system to work with the Proto-type Color TV, it would make all the Black & White Tvs obsolete, and of course "The Masses would Revolt". So they had to come up with a color Tv that was compatible with the (at that Time) present black & white Tv system.

A few years ago, it was estimated that High-definition/High-resolution tv would be mass distributed and the WHole NTSC or PAL system would be changed to accomendate the H-D/H-R Tvs. They had to change the Horizontal and Vertical Sweep rates of the Whole TV Standard to match the sweep rates of a computer monitor. They estimated that they would gradually phase all the NTSC and PAL Tv stations out and have the New Set-ups in over the next 7 years. It was to be started in 1998, and by the Year 2000 only have 2 NTSC and PAL stations still on line, and by the year 2002 the TV signal standards would be changed and everyone would be watching H-D/H-R TVs. And of course us old tv set owners would have the option of buying, for about $200.00(in American Currency), a convertor box that would convert the New Changed TV Standard, back to the Old standard so our old TVs would still work. Well, it's 2002 and I've still yet to hear of one single Tv station being converted to a new Standard of any kind. So much for their predictions.

Well I guess I have written a book to read! LOL! Sorry!

Here is something else I believe:

 2Tim.1:7," For GOD hath not Given US the spirit of Fear, but one of Power, and of Love, and a Sound Mind."

Have a Great & Wonderful Day, My GOOD PROXO-FRIENDS!
"TV-JAK"



 
 

seeker1

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Forget security, privacy and Proxo
« Reply #7 on: July 05, 2002, 02:18:01 PM »
Quote:

2Tim.1:7," For GOD hath not Given US the spirit of Fear, but one of Power, and of Love, and a Sound Mind."
------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
My comments should not be taken as a rant of panic, but of a valid concern, not just for myself, but the world at large.  If we are to live with a spirit of power and love, doesn't that mean that we should do all that we can to help and protect others and not be satisfied with just securing our own computers.   I realize that there is a futility in expecting anywhere near 100% success in this, but in my own small way, I'm doing what I can.  It doesn't matter how many people don't listen, I just hope that a few will.   In his mercy, God has shown more than once that he is willing to delay the outcome of a prophecy, when people turn to him.  Maybe this doesn't have much to do with turning people to God, but it certainly has a lot to do with prophecy.   I have been posting similar threads on all of the forums that I frequent, but it is odd, the ones that I would have thought would have the greatest concern about a security issue such as this, seem to take little notice.  But on another, where the members are almost all young men, who care little about anything others than money, sex and their computer games, are considerably more concerned  than is apparent here.  Well, I don't like to nag anyone, so I will just close by wishing you peace and happiness.

"Let every man be swift to hear, slow to speak, slow to wrath"

James 1:19 <><
"Let every man be swift to hear, slow to speak, slow to wrath"

James 1:19 <><

JakBeNymble

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Forget security, privacy and Proxo
« Reply #8 on: July 05, 2002, 05:48:16 PM »
Dear "Seeker1",

              I think that You might be somewhat surprised to read this.
http://asp.flaaten.dk/pforum/topic.asp?ARCHIVE=&TOPIC_ID=695
I hope that You Have a Wondeful and Delightful Day, My Friend!
"Jak"

 
 

hpguru

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Forget security, privacy and Proxo
« Reply #9 on: July 05, 2002, 06:51:08 PM »
quote:
...I may just go offline permanently and take up my old hobby of macrophotography.


quote:

hpguru,

I share your sentiment, but I guess that I'm just stubborn enough to continue to fight until the battle is lost.


quote:

Buddha told a parable in a sutra:

A man traveling across a field encountered a tiger. He fled, the tiger after him. Coming to a precipice, he caught hold of the root of a wild vine and swung himself down over the edge. The tiger sniffed at him from above. Trembling, the man looked down to where, far below, another tiger was waiting to eat him. Only the vine sustained him.

Two mice, one white and one black started to gnaw away at the vine. The man saw a lucious strawberry near him. Grasping the vine with one hand, he plucked the strawberry with the other. How sweet is tasted!





Facing each other,
a thousand miles apart.
Facing each other,
a thousand miles apart.